Debate on the abduction/contact experience between Budd Hopkins and Dr John E. Mack

Published by UFOTV The Disclosure Network on October 11, 2011: "The Alien Abduction Experience - Budd Hopkins and Dr. John E. Mack". Duration: 1:03:20.

From UFOTV®, accept no imitations. EBE Award Winner! Feature Length - In loving memory of Budd Hopkins 1931 - 2011, and John E. Mack, M.D. 1929 - 2004, and their contribution to Alien Abduction and Extreme Experience Research. 

Legendary Alien Abduction Researchers - Budd Hopkins - Author, Researcher and John Mack, M.D. - Harvard Professor of Psychiatry, come together to discuss what they believe is happening to people who report experiences of being abducted by Aliens and taken aboard their craft. Get the facts in this rare and heart felt presentation. Originally taped in 1997.

The discussion between Budd Hopkins and Dr John E. Mack about the "alien abduction experience" provides a helpful overview of different perspectives on , what I call, the "contact aspect" of the UFO-phenomena.

When I watched the dialogue from 1997 with Hopkins and Mack, I thought: Why isn't this kind of honest UFO discussion on TV today? Or even in the so-called alternative media?

Around the 38 minutes mark, the audience gets to ask questions to Hopkins and Mack. Most of them very good questions that triggers interesting and respectful debate between Hopkins and Mack.

I respect both of the gentlemen, Hopkins and Mack, for their work and contribution to the study of the contact aspect of the UFO-phenomena. In particular, I respect Dr John E. Mack's courage to risk his reputation as a clinician and his academic standing when he listened to people's stories about their extraordinary experiences.

In this debate, I mostly agree with Dr John E. Mack's perspective on the "alien abduction experience."  But I can also see and understand where Budd Hopkins is coming from.

My interpretation of Mack's perspective is that he does not want to make the contact aspect a question of "good" or "bad" "aliens". He suspects we will never get the full answers to the contact/abduction phenomenon.

Instead, Mack urges us to go from a literal interpretation of the phenomenon to a more ontological one. What does the phenomenon say about our perception of reality, ourselves and the planet we are living on?

The contact aspect of the UFO-phenomenon is complex, to say the least. It is up to each individual to make up their own mind about the contact/abduction aspect. But in order to do so, we at least have to give the research and material a fair chance. 

We cannot dismiss the contact aspect of the UFO-phenomena without first looking at the material with both an open and a skeptical mind. If we have given the research a fair chance, then it is ok to disagree with parts of it or dismiss it as a whole. 

"Curiosity didn't kill the cat. Ignorance did." - Unknown

Take care!

Ariel School UFO encounter witness

Published by Martin Willis Live Shows on YouTube. Live broadcast played on October 18, 2017. Duration: 1:29:48.

Salma Siddick (Ariel School Encounter Witness) brilliantly tells her story during the Ariel School encounter on September 16, 1994. Randy Nickerson discusses his film of the event Ariel Phenomenon. Host Martin Willis, Podcast UFO: http://podcastufo.com Show notes: http://podcastufo.com/show-notes/salm... Help fund the completion of this important film: https://igg.me/at/arielfilm/x/10708920

What happens when you see something so extraordinary that no one believes you? Filmmaker Randall Nickerson is exploring this question through his upcoming feature-length documentary, Ariel Phenomenon. The film explores an event in 1994 when sixty school children claim to have seen an unusual space craft land near their primary school in Ruwa, Zimbabwe and witnessed an incredible event that, to this day, they can hardly comprehend themselves.

This is a continuation of my last post about the "Ariel Phenomenon", which you can find here.
As you can read in the quotes above, host Martin Willis interviewed one of the over 60 school children, Salma Siddick, who had an extraordinary experience in Zimbabwe, 1994. 

Another guest on the show is Randall Nickerson, the director and producer of the documentary "Ariel Phenomenon", portraying the extraordinary event that Salma and the other children shared in Zimbabwe in 1994.

The live broadcast had some technical issues throughout the broadcast, especially in the beginning. However, the interview with both Salma Siddick and Randall Nickerson is still worth watching and listening to. The interview with Salma starts around the 4:30 minutes mark.

I leave it up to the curious reader to form their own opinions about the Ariel School UFO encounter in Ruwa, Zimbabwe, 1994.

I find it hard to believe that the Ariel School UFO event from 1994 was fabricated by Salma Siddick, the other kids, and witnesses.

School children share an extraordinary experience in Zimbabwe, 1994

[Addendum 2026-06-02: I have erased the link to the promotion trailer for the documentary Ariel Phenomenon referenced below because it did not work. Otherwise, the blog post is the same as the original one from 2018. The important point of this post is that it marks a transition of the blog's focus from the physical aspect to the experiencer and high strangeness aspects of UFOs/UAP. - J. T]

We are now leaving the physical aspect - the "nuts n`bolts" aspect - of the UFO phenomenon(-na), and entering a much more bizarre and puzzling aspect. 

This blog post marks the start of a series exploring the stories of people who claim to have interacted with extraterrestrials, specifically focusing on those who say they were contacted or abducted by them.

I will refer to this aspect of the UFO phenomena as the "contact aspect", even if the contactee and abductee cases can be seen as different categories or experiences.  

I will not go through the history of the contact aspect or present material on all the most well-documented cases. I am not trying to convince anyone that there is solid evidence supporting the contact aspect to be real. Well, who decides what is "real" and how?

Because I have found no kind of evidence to support people's claims of having had communication or encounters with non-human intelligence. But again, there are questions about what we count as "evidence", in which context, and by whom?

With that said, I believe some of those claims and stories are worth listening to and taking seriously. And my main purpose with this and coming posts on the contact aspect of the UFO phenomena is to present some of the credible cases so that the reader can evaluate the material and make up their own mind.

One of those credible stories - or contact cases - worth taking seriously is the one about the experience that over 60 school children and other witnesses shared in Ruwa, Zimbabwe, in 1994.

The YouTube clip above is a promotion trailer for the full-length documentary "Ariel Phenomenon" that is trying to raise public awareness of the event in Ruwa, -94.

You can read more about what the 60 school children experienced in -94 and about the documentary "Ariel Phenomenon" here.

Whether we believe that some of the more credible contact cases happened - like the one in Ruwa in 1994 - there is no doubt in my mind that in some of the contact cases the individuals are sincere and truly believe in their experiences. In most contact cases, the individuals seem to be affected profoundly by their experiences. Sometimes positively, sometimes negatively, and perhaps most often, affected by their experience in a complex way of both "good and bad."

If anything, the contact cases show that the UFO-phenomena do not fit neatly into a category or box. Yes, the physical aspect of  UFOs is validated, but even the nuts n´bolts aspect has far more questions than answers.

The contact aspect of the UFO-phenomena is truly and highly strange. Even weird sometimes. But I cannot help thinking that the contact aspect has something essential to tell us about the UFO-phenomena and the nature of consciousness and its interaction with matter, space, and time. The answer(s) may have something to do with non-human intelligence. Whatever "they" are, and where ever "they" may come from.

Take care!

Senator Harry Reid about Pentagon's UFO-program, AATIP

• https://www.lasvegasnow.com/news/i-team-exclusive-nevada-senator-fought-to-save-secret-ufo-program/1272272877

The link above leads to an article by George Knapp and Matt Adams for the "I-Team." Knapp and Adams write about a document from 2009, "in which Reid made the case for protecting and expanding the project." 

The quote is about the Pentagon's UFO program, called AATIP, which is well-known among UFO enthusiasts. Paul Dean, who studies UFOs, has discovered a new name and acronym besides AATIP. The question is whether these different names represent separate UFO projects. "Reid" is Senator Harry Reid, who initiated the military study of UFO encounters in 2007.

According to Knapp and Adams' article from June 28, 2018, Senator Reid in a 2009 letter to the deputy secretary of defence said, "that the AATIP study was already a success, and that exotic technologies could be catastrophic if used by our adversaries."

Why is that statement interesting? First, Senator Reid is saying that the AATIP was a success almost immediately after its implementation. But perhaps most intriguing is that Senator Reid's statement goes against the spokesperson for the AATIP, who said something to the effect of: "We did not learn much and it was decided to spend the taxpayers' money on something else."

The Pentagon has said that the program ended in 2012. Luis Elizondo, the former director of AATIP and now at the "To the Stars Academy", has said that only the funding ended in 2012, but that the program was still running when he left his position as the director of AATIP.

The link above has also a 4 minutes short news clip with George Knapp interviewing Senator Harry Reid and Luis Elizondo about the 2009 document/letter. Very interesting in the clip is the segment with Dr Hal Puthoff talking to a science group in Las Vegas. Listen closely to what Dr Puthoff was telling the group of scientists.

 

• http://nymag.com/selectall/2018/03/harry-reid-on-what-the-government-knows-about-ufos.html

The link to the New York Magazine leads to another interview - a more in-depth interview than the first link above - with Senator Harry Reid. In this article he goes into more detail about his involvement in the AATIP, why a scientific approach in the study of the UFO phenomenon is crucial, etc.

Below is a quote from Senator Harry Reid on the question of secrecy or not, or a cover-up or not, regarding information about the UFO-phenomenon.

Let me give you something that the press has totally failed and conjured. We have hundreds and hundreds of papers, pages of paper, that have been available since this was completed. Most all of it, 80 percent at least, is public. You know something? The press has never even looked at it. Not once. That’s where we are. I wanted it public, it was made public, and you guys have not even looked at it

 

Take care!

Navy pilot and Commander David Fravor about his Tic Tac Ufo encounter

Below you will find a two-part interview with Navy pilot and commander David Fravor made by documentary filmmaker Jeremy Corbell.

It is an important interview in which Commander David Fravor clarifies some speculations and misconceptions, according to him, about the video and written report on the "Tic Tac" incident off the coast of San Diego in 2004.

People who read this blog probably saw the NYT article from December 16, 2017, about the Pentagon's UFO program, AATIP, which showed the Tic Tac UFO video. If not, you can read the NYT article and watch the Tic Tac video here.

To the Stars Academy (TTSA) published the report on the Tic Tac encounter on its website, and you can read the report here.

Anyone seriously interested in the UFO-phenomenon - skeptics and believers - should listen carefully to the whole interview (parts one and two).

Ask relevant and critical questions. Not just only on this one UFO encounter, but also how it fits - or does not fit - in the bigger picture of the UFO-phenomenon.

The key question is: How should the Tic Tac UFO incident affect the scientific study and public discussion of UFOs?

Published on June 23, 2018, on Jeremy Corbell's YouTube channel. Duration: 28:13 minutes. Part one.

Published on June 27, 2018, on Jeremy Corbell's YouTube channel. Duration: 26:07 minutes. Part two.